JUNE 12 UPDATE: We toned down the text which seemed to offend someone, or so they claimed, someone who evidently took this post too seriously, and we removed the image (but it's saved incase the FB post disappears). As for paid private lessons, they are indeed allowed, as one commenter has noted and contrary to what others are claiming. The rate is actually $35/hr, not $25 as someone suggested in a comment (see the Ground School manual link in one of the comments--Thanks). Of course not all of that goes to the instructor. The club skims most of it for "overhead" and the instructor gets his/her regular wage. As usual, a certain commenter(s) is the one with an apparent axe to grind, and our info was correct. And of course we are aware that at least two students are required for a regular lesson to take place, but that has no bearing on private/one-on-one lessons.
Hilarious public Facebook post here:
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10108181353483917
Check out the Facebook link which includes inappropriate comments that were removed and comments with typos that suggest giddy excitement. Welcome to Hooters, er, Hoofers.
Although the club isn't advertized this way, people looking for a good time can join and skip the sailing. Better yet, save $250 and just come to the Friday socials. Or heck, just go out to the nearest bar. On the other hand, someone who really wants to learn to sail probably isn't going to do any better with private lessons because it's best to try out different instructors, although a beginner might not know that.
For the record, private lessons are allowed, but only for paid instructors. If you are an unpaid (volunteer) instructor, for some reason paid private lessons are not in your future.
As for general club members, giving a paid private lesson (or any lesson) could get you suspended from the club and/or charged with unlawfully captaining a boat. Why would anyone expect to get paid for teaching a lesson anyway? Because the objective of some people is not to contribute in a club environment but rather to enrich themselves (at your expense). This may be a 'club' by name, but underneath, it is a jobs program for unqualified friends of the commodore.
A graph of skyrocketing instructor pay over time is here.
As is your habit Fleet Kommander, you are taking great liberties with the truth. There ARE no "private lessons" available at Hoofers. If any non-member is thinking of joining but wants to have a look first, literally ANY instructor will take them out on a lesson to let them see if joining Hoofers is what they desire.
ReplyDeleteIn fact, ANY of us would get fired were we to take tips, charge members OR non-members to sail, or anything of the sort. You forget that we are all state employees, and as such are bound by an ethical code that you do not seem to care about. Clearly, morality and ethics and facts elude you.
If you are going to continue putting out this drivel to your five readers, how about some examples with the name of ANY instructor who has charged or gets paid other than for hours worked to teach others how to sail? As well, we do NOT get paid for anything other than on-the-water instruction. Even then, if we do not have two non-rated students we cannot claim this time.
As a result, many lessons with a rated member or members on a refresher (a smart thing to do at the beginning of each year) and only another student are done for nothing. Simply because we care about teaching others to capture the love of sailing as so many of us have. The refresher lessons make us all safer and better sailors. That is worth not getting paid hours for instruction.
More than a few of us care deeply about this club, Kommander. All you seem to want to do is grind axes over events that happened a decade ago. Perhaps come down and see what Hoofers is actually like? Sign on as an instructor perhaps? At the very least, try to work with some facts, and not hearsay, half-truths, or outright lies.
You are only slightly removed from a world of witches, warlocks, and the talisman.
Hearts and flowers
A-NON
This may be a terminology issue if by "paid private lessons" what is meant is "one on one lessons". These are indeed allowed, although most instructors never teach one. I have not asked Dave about it lately, so it could have changed this year I suppose. It might be limited to lead instructors, but I guarantee the mechanism for paid individual lessons exists. Do you really think if a club member comes in and says "I want to pay someone $25/hour to teach me one-on-one at doing [fill in the blank]", that they will say no?
ReplyDeleteSo then, anonymous....
ReplyDeleteToday I spent digging round in our system, as well as questioning anyone that I could find about "paid private lessons" or "paid one-on-one lessons". Because I have full system access, I can guarantee YOU that such a thing does not, nor has it ever existed.
Also, in asking round the OUW staff, checking the system, and questioning our club leaders, I am the only instructor anyone remembers who has taken a sailor and/or prospective member out for a private lesson. Twice in seven years. In neither case was I paid. As I said, one needs two students on-board in order to claim the time.
So many things that the Fleet Kommander says are half truths, or slanted versions of the truth that seem to fill some apparent need he has to criticize everyone but himself. The paid private lesson comments, and his entire post put forth as fact something that was an outright lie. Please check on your own?
If any instructor was ever found to have taken money in exchange for a private lesson, they would be discharged. Period. Pardon my language here, but hopefully the Fleet Kommanders "readers" will eventually figure out that he is full of shit.
Hearts and flowers
A-Non
I think a mechanism existed for HOI to make special arrangements. One might think of it as part of fast tracking which does get mentioned in the ground school manual. If a student was to request a private lesson and if the student was asked to pay a nominal fee, that fee does not go directly to the instructor. Rather, it would have gone into some account. If an instructor received compensation for this, it would be in the form of that instructor having the time authorized as paid hour by the HOI.
ReplyDeleteThere is a discussion about private lesson on page 7 of the ground school manual
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BywZ-rLn0R8hdlU4YTc5RjhKVVlwYjBxTnZ0Wk4yVF9CWjNz/edit
linked from the HSC website
http://www.hoofersailing.org/?q=instruction/manuals
Was the part about instructor getting billable time credit in such an arrangement ever formally documented or set in policy by the BOC? Probably not. I think the organization implicitly granted the discretion to manage such instances to the HOI. I think, most of the time, what happens is that HOI receives a request like this via referral, and then, taps on some instructor and asks to do something and possibly authorize it to be on a clock.
(There was, however, a one-on-one 1 hour lessons which was formally implemented. The math adds up because if fill up at least two hours, you would met that two student minimum. All of theses issues were mute for volunteer instructors.)
I am sure there situations where an experienced member was solicited to coach someone's sailing for a pitcher of beer or some sort of barter. This is a perfectly natural behavior in a social organization like the HSC. One difference between instructors on staff and non-instructors though is that only instructors on staff (paid or volunteer) can grant ratings. I'm sure there were plenty of instances where some instructors felt comfortable giving out rating after a day sailing session over the years, which is technically an exercise in privilege. Is such a practice in itself a bad thing? I tend not to think so unless it is abused egregiously. I am sure though that there were some questionable cases also in the long history. I would concur that rating being given strictly because of some barter is completely in appropriate. Another example might be if a highly experienced sailor joining the club gets tons of ratings granted upon arrival just on the account of his/her experience without having to jump the hoops like everyone else. On the other hand, HSC also strives not to withhold ratings unnecessarily. The conflict between liberal and conservative interpretation of the ratings has always been a difficult issue for HSC and I'm sure it will continue to be so. In principle, the BOC sets policy on these things but in practice (and for better or worse), a lot of executive decision making is delegated to the HOI.
From what I witnessed, HSC appears to have gradually evolved from an impromptu to a formal organization. This meant HSC could continue to receive endorsement from society at large (administration, insurance agencies, risk management, etc) but I also recognize that the organization had to give up a lot of freedom in the process. In the past, just about anyone who wanted to could serve in an instructor capacity (from what I hear). Slowly, the system for appointing and administering instructors got formalized and in the end a lot of the discretion got delegated implicitly to the HOI. I also recognize that a lot of magic was lost in this gradual evolution.
In any case, the best way to find out how such a request (private lesson scheduled by the student) gets handled is to make precisely this inquiry to the HOI (or club leaders) and see what happens.
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDeleteHear Hear to Anonymous at 0636 this morning. No real human being could have put it better than you have here. But Fleet Kommander revels in this stuff. In fact, I think that he is blinded by all of the sparks coming from his grinding axes. He does seem captivated by young kids though, as he repeats this often enough.
ReplyDeleteOn "private lessons" or "one on one lessons" to Anonymous at 0615 am (PDT on times because Kommander apparently does not know how to fix this on his hate-computer) there IS no account on the system to account for these type of lessons. As well, I DID have a student inquire at the front desk about a one-on-one lesson. Not surprisingly, the student was told that these are NOT offered.
On fast-tracking. Again, a half truth, which makes me wonder if Fleet Kommander is also writing comments (yet again) on his own posts. A fast track student is one that has extensive sailing experience.
There is NO reason to clutter up the already hard to find Tech lessons in order to give them basic experience that they already have! We have enough backlog as it is. In essence, a fast-track skips what the member already knows. Lastly, NO ONE is given a fast-track without on the water instruction with an instructor.
Yesterday I had a fast-track member. This member had raced for two decades and sailed for three. The member legitimately rated in a sloop on a single lesson. The member was THAT good. Are YOU going to be the one to tell the member that they have to pick up a Tech rating? If you did, the member would be gone.
Hearts and flowers
A-Non
@Anonymous at 06:36: We deleted your comment because it contained falsehoods presented as fact. (This isn't to say that every single point made by every other commenter is necessarily correct.)
ReplyDeleteYou obviously know little of Hoofers--only the superficial things one learns by taking a lesson every once in awhile and coming to the occasional Friday social. If you spent some time and dug a little deeper, maybe get on the BOC, you would find that everything in this blog is true. We don't claim that every single detail is 100% correct--that's not realistic--but the overwhelming gist of it is.
The blog paints a true and fair picture of Hoofer Sailing Club and particularly of its nepotistic paid instruction/jobs program and ratings system. HSC is like Lake Mendota: clean in parts but polluted with toxic algae and dead fish in others. We don't focus on the clean parts because they are covered by the club's official site.
Thank you for removing the picture and horrific comments as I earlier requested. You're still a terrible human being. There's a special place in hell for people like you
ReplyDeleteWow, hell just for making a possibly-insensitive blog post about a goofy Facebook page..? If so, then I shudder to think where some of the actual crooks we cover on this blog will end up.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDeleteLast thing, Kommander;
ReplyDeleteThe private lesson language in the Ground School manual was put there by YOU It was not edited out because it was missed in the various revisions. Hard to believe that it stayed in the manual when you edited it so long ago, is it not?
You are a real, smarmy, piece of work.
Hearts and flowers
A-Non
Ouch, Fleet Kommander;
ReplyDeleteYou really do NOT like comments that shed a bit of light on your Wizard of Oz approach to the facts, huh? How come you removed my perfectly valid comments, as well as Anonymous 616 am's comments? And you remove them without noting same. That surely causes some suspicion in those who might have seen them when you were asleep.
Do you NOT want your readers to know the REAL story behind your scattershot approach the truth? Do you really not want your five readers to know some of the honest and pertinent comments others make that tend to put you in a not so good light? Why?
All you do is illustrate that you ARE in fact a chickenshit wannabe blogster dealing in lies and half truths, most all of them twisted to suit your narrative that Hoofers is full of crooks and others on the take....even when it is not? Even when you do not name these so called crooks and provide ANY proof?
Could it be that you were one of them?
Hearts and flowers
A-Non
@A-Non: Maybe you should do a little reading instead of writing all the time and take a look at this page (among others):
ReplyDeletehttp://hoofersailing.blogspot.com/2013/10/the-hoofer-syndicate.html
Some documents/proof are referenced there and on the embedded links. Try to find the relevant BOC minutes--if you can. The club isn't very good about posting them, and older ones tend to disappear. Moreover, minutes are often edited, with incriminating things removed. Thus, any incriminating point that remains is only the tip of an iceberg.
As far as your earlier comment that says: "The private lesson language in the Ground School manual was put there by YOU"
By us? If so, that would mean one of us used to help edit the GS manual. Which is entirely possible, but so what? You can't seriously believe something like private lessons would get into the manual without approval of the HOI or Hoofer Advisor.
Hey Kommander...what do you want? In your words...."Most of it was true!" Also, another truth for you. The HOI OR BOC do not read manual revisions. Most often, if not always, this is left with the fleet captain and those they appoint. In many years I have YET to see an adviser read a manual revision. And yes, things DO get missed.
ReplyDeleteHearts and flowers
A-Non
P.S. You are beginning to bore me. Liven things up, okay?
ReplyDeleteA-Non
Moving on then. Hey, here's a topic. Students anymore don't know that Hoofers used to have over 1,000 members in the club, got by on $200,000 a year, and we had the biggest fleet of boats of any inland college sailing club. The summer alumni magazine quotes Dave Elsmo (who is the commodore anyway?) saying that it sells about 300 memberships per year. There were just 5 boats out for Tech racing last night, but that maybe the entire operational fleet? Now the Union sailing program has a lot of staff and they're shilling for $3 million for piers. Spending more and more money to serve less and less members every year?
ReplyDeleteAh, the union did not shell out any money for the new deck/pier system. This was done through donations from Wisconsin Alumni. So next time you hammer on the sailing team, just remember that they become future alumni, okay?
ReplyDeleteOh, and the club still has a thousand members. Did you forget that people tend to graduate, or what?
Hmm, so 300 memberships sold per year X 4 years to graduate = over 1000 memberships! That makes sense. If you're a nutritional science major.
ReplyDeleteThe fact that people DO graduate means that 300 paying members are graduating each year and NOT paying to join the following year. (unless they are losers and stay in Madison)
What i am wondering now is, Do sailing team members ever actually graduate?
What, are you a nutritional science major? Or a loser still here in Madison like the Fleet Commander? There are tens of thousands of students on this campus. Do the math. You do not actually deserve more of an answer than that.
ReplyDeleteYou can also look at the sailing team roster to see for yourself that yes, they do graduate. And they become the alumni who give you pretty docks and boats.
Think you're missing the core concept here, fellow Anonymous. More money, less people, less boats. A _lot_ less boats and a lot less sailing. It doesn't matter where the money came from, the cost effectiveness is cratering.
ReplyDelete